Topics

Any Plans for JTalert to use Multicast?

Richard Dubey
 

Hello,
Been having an issue setting up Gridtracker and JTAlert.
I have WSJT-z (yes "z") UDP 127.0.0.1 Port 2237 (with the three boxes checked)
I have JTAlert set up (In the application section, under WSJT-x) to rebroadcast UDP to 127.0.0.1 Port 2234
I have Gridtracker set up to receive UDP on port 2234. Whenever I try to enable multicast the IP box is red if I put in 127.0.0.1, However if I put in 224.0.0.1 then it's green (of course it doesn't match what is in JTAlert).
Would I have to change the rebroadcast from JTAlert to 224.0.0.1 port 2234
Or is it not working because JTAlert doesn't do multicast yet? (or does it?) I had heard some discussion that was planned for a future release but I'm not sure how old the discussion was.
73
W1SPS

Michael Black
 

JTAlert V2 does not do multicast.  V3 will when released.

Mike W9MDB




On Monday, July 27, 2020, 11:06:56 AM CDT, W1SPS via groups.io <w1sps@...> wrote:


Hello,
Been having an issue setting up Gridtracker and JTAlert.
I have WSJT-z (yes "z") UDP 127.0.0.1 Port 2237 (with the three boxes checked)
I have JTAlert set up (In the application section, under WSJT-x) to rebroadcast UDP to 127.0.0.1 Port 2234
I have Gridtracker set up to receive UDP on port 2234. Whenever I try to enable multicast the IP box is red if I put in 127.0.0.1, However if I put in 224.0.0.1 then it's green (of course it doesn't match what is in JTAlert).
Would I have to change the rebroadcast from JTAlert to 224.0.0.1 port 2234
Or is it not working because JTAlert doesn't do multicast yet? (or does it?) I had heard some discussion that was planned for a future release but I'm not sure how old the discussion was.
73
W1SPS

Richard Dubey
 

Any ETA, just curious

On Jul 27, 2020, at 12:19 PM, Michael Black via groups.io <mdblack98@...> wrote:


JTAlert V2 does not do multicast.  V3 will when released.

Mike W9MDB




On Monday, July 27, 2020, 11:06:56 AM CDT, W1SPS via groups.io <w1sps@...> wrote:


Hello,
Been having an issue setting up Gridtracker and JTAlert.
I have WSJT-z (yes "z") UDP 127.0.0.1 Port 2237 (with the three boxes checked)
I have JTAlert set up (In the application section, under WSJT-x) to rebroadcast UDP to 127.0.0.1 Port 2234
I have Gridtracker set up to receive UDP on port 2234. Whenever I try to enable multicast the IP box is red if I put in 127.0.0.1, However if I put in 224.0.0.1 then it's green (of course it doesn't match what is in JTAlert).
Would I have to change the rebroadcast from JTAlert to 224.0.0.1 port 2234
Or is it not working because JTAlert doesn't do multicast yet? (or does it?) I had heard some discussion that was planned for a future release but I'm not sure how old the discussion was.
73
W1SPS

Michael Black
 

Laurie hasn't announce a date yet. A bit hard to predict me thinkst.

Mike W9MDB




On Monday, July 27, 2020, 12:43:48 PM CDT, Richard Dubey via groups.io <w1sps@...> wrote:


Any ETA, just curious

On Jul 27, 2020, at 12:19 PM, Michael Black via groups.io <mdblack98@...> wrote:


JTAlert V2 does not do multicast.  V3 will when released.

Mike W9MDB




On Monday, July 27, 2020, 11:06:56 AM CDT, W1SPS via groups.io <w1sps@...> wrote:


Hello,
Been having an issue setting up Gridtracker and JTAlert.
I have WSJT-z (yes "z") UDP 127.0.0.1 Port 2237 (with the three boxes checked)
I have JTAlert set up (In the application section, under WSJT-x) to rebroadcast UDP to 127.0.0.1 Port 2234
I have Gridtracker set up to receive UDP on port 2234. Whenever I try to enable multicast the IP box is red if I put in 127.0.0.1, However if I put in 224.0.0.1 then it's green (of course it doesn't match what is in JTAlert).
Would I have to change the rebroadcast from JTAlert to 224.0.0.1 port 2234
Or is it not working because JTAlert doesn't do multicast yet? (or does it?) I had heard some discussion that was planned for a future release but I'm not sure how old the discussion was.
73
W1SPS

HamApps Support (VK3AMA)
 

On 28/07/2020 12:54 am, W1SPS via groups.io wrote:
Or is it not working because JTAlert doesn't do multicast yet?

JTAlertV2 does not support multicast UDP. This is due to a lack of UDP multicast functionality in the AutoIT compiler used to create JTAlertV2.

de Laurie VK3AMA

Michel
 

JTALERT is not compatible with WSJT-Z
JTALERT block all report sent and received by WSJT-Z.
You can use GRIDTRACKER and WSJT-Z only but not with JTALERT
73 Michel

Richard Dubey
 

I see. Well I will uninstall WJST-z and replace with WSJT-x and hopefully everything will go back to normal. I wouldn’t have thought they changed so much that it would have rendered WJST-z non functional. Oh well. 

On Jul 28, 2020, at 3:39 AM, Michel <micheluze@...> wrote:

JTALERT is not compatible with WSJT-Z
JTALERT block all report sent and received by WSJT-Z.
You can use GRIDTRACKER and WSJT-Z only but not with JTALERT
73 Michel

neil_zampella
 

There's that little bit they changed that allows for robot operations ... kinda goes against the wishes of the WSJT-X developers, as well as the FCC regulations in the US, and a few other countries regulations.

 

Neil, KN3ILZ

Richard Dubey
 

I had no use for the robot operations, I just wanted to see how much the interface changed. I wouldn’t mind seeing the resolution of WSJT-x (Visually) just prettied up a bit. A little more like SDRUno. Higher res waterfall, less windows looking, commonly activated button near each other, etc. I like the eye candy, lol. Wish I knew programming.

On Jul 28, 2020, at 6:20 AM, neil_zampella <neilz@...> wrote:



There's that little bit they changed that allows for robot operations ... kinda goes against the wishes of the WSJT-X developers, as well as the FCC regulations in the US, and a few other countries regulations.

 

Neil, KN3ILZ

Mike Rhodes
 

...but if you devote more processor power to "eye candy", what will happen to the performance of WSJT-X? It is already doing an unbelievable amount of crunching. I'm fine with using the power where it does the most good.

Mike / W8DN

On 7/28/2020 6:54 AM, Richard Dubey via groups.io wrote:
I had no use for the robot operations, I just wanted to see how much the interface changed. I wouldn’t mind seeing the resolution of WSJT-x (Visually) just prettied up a bit. A little more like SDRUno. Higher res waterfall, less windows looking, commonly activated button near each other, etc. I like the eye candy, lol. Wish I knew programming.

On Jul 28, 2020, at 6:20 AM, neil_zampella <neilz@...> wrote:



There's that little bit they changed that allows for robot operations ... kinda goes against the wishes of the WSJT-X developers, as well as the FCC regulations in the US, and a few other countries regulations.

Neil, KN3ILZ

Richard Dubey
 

Well, I guess it depends on the computer. Mine isn’t taxed very much while running HRD, HRD logger, Gridtracker, WSJT-x, JTAlert, a time sync, my browser with 8 or 10 tabs open, Netlogger (that just is always on in the background), and all the usual windows detritus. But my computers are older decommissioned CAD workstations I’ve built and “retired”.

I just like software to look as nice as it works.

On Jul 28, 2020, at 1:30 PM, Mike Rhodes <weightdn@...> wrote:

...but if you devote more processor power to "eye candy", what will happen to the performance of WSJT-X? It is already doing an unbelievable amount of crunching. I'm fine with using the power where it does the most good.

Mike / W8DN

On 7/28/2020 6:54 AM, Richard Dubey via groups.io wrote:
I had no use for the robot operations, I just wanted to see how much the interface changed. I wouldn’t mind seeing the resolution of WSJT-x (Visually) just prettied up a bit. A little more like SDRUno. Higher res waterfall, less windows looking, commonly activated button near each other, etc. I like the eye candy, lol. Wish I knew programming.

On Jul 28, 2020, at 6:20 AM, neil_zampella <neilz@...> wrote:


There's that little bit they changed that allows for robot operations ... kinda goes against the wishes of the WSJT-X developers, as well as the FCC regulations in the US, and a few other countries regulations.

Neil, KN3ILZ


Carl - WC4H
 

Hi Richard.

To use both JTAlerts & GridTracker you need to flip what you are doing.
Let GridTracker listen on Port 2237, then turn on "Forward UDP Messages" to another port box (IE: 2238) in GT.  In GT these settimgs are in the General tab of settings.

For this to work, you MUST launch GridTracker first, then JTAlerts.  JTAlerts automatically finds the port that WSJT-X is using, so when you launch GT first, JTA will see port 2238 (in my example) and listen there.   It does not seem to work the other way around.

You can also turn on "Multicast" but if you just want to run the 2 programs simultaneously, it is not necessary.

This setup seems to work OK.  I have tested it and I have a friend that does it routinely.

If you are logging to DXLab, HRD, etc., you have to decide which program you want to do the logging so that you do not get duplicate entries.  You may also want to decide which of the two to use for sound alerts.

73.
Carl - WC4H

Dave Garber
 

I had no problem getting wsjtx, jta, and gridtracker all working together without multicast.  I was even sending to n3fjp, via GT, so no need for multicast here


Dave Garber
VE3WEJ / VE3IE


On Mon, Aug 3, 2020 at 10:34 PM Carl - WC4H via groups.io <wc4h.dx=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hi Richard.

To use both JTAlerts & GridTracker you need to flip what you are doing.
Let GridTracker listen on Port 2237, then turn on "Forward UDP Messages" to another port box (IE: 2238) in GT.  In GT these settimgs are in the General tab of settings.

For this to work, you MUST launch GridTracker first, then JTAlerts.  JTAlerts automatically finds the port that WSJT-X is using, so when you launch GT first, JTA will see port 2238 (in my example) and listen there.   It does not seem to work the other way around.

You can also turn on "Multicast" but if you just want to run the 2 programs simultaneously, it is not necessary.

This setup seems to work OK.  I have tested it and I have a friend that does it routinely.

If you are logging to DXLab, HRD, etc., you have to decide which program you want to do the logging so that you do not get duplicate entries.  You may also want to decide which of the two to use for sound alerts.

73.
Carl - WC4H

Charlie Hoffman
 

On Tue, Aug 4, 2020 at 03:00 AM, Dave Garber wrote:
I had no problem getting wsjtx, jta, and gridtracker all working together without multicast.
I also had no problem with them working together without multicast.
I've even been able to run GT on an old computer that's on the same network to free up screen space on my main computer.

Dave Garber
 

what does multicast acheive
Dave Garber
VE3WEJ / VE3IE


On Tue, Aug 4, 2020 at 1:55 PM Charlie Hoffman <hoffmanc@...> wrote:
On Tue, Aug 4, 2020 at 03:00 AM, Dave Garber wrote:
I had no problem getting wsjtx, jta, and gridtracker all working together without multicast.
I also had no problem with them working together without multicast.
I've even been able to run GT on an old computer that's on the same network to free up screen space on my main computer.

Kyle K7KE
 

If you have an old PC or tablet lying around, you can get additional screen real estate for your main PC with this free program:  https//deskspace.net

Kyle
K7KE
https://k7ke.com

HamApps Support (VK3AMA)
 

On 5/08/2020 6:01 am, Kyle K7KE wrote:
If you have an old PC or tablet lying around, you can get additional screen real estate for your main PC with this free program:  https//deskspace.net

Kyle
K7KE

I believe the correct link is https://spacedesk.net/

de Laurie VK3AMA

g4wjs
 

Hi Dave,

the WSJT-X UDP Message Protocol allows multiple WSJT_X instances (the clients in this relationship) to interoperate with another application (the server in this relationship). Messages are sent from WSJT-X instances to the server specified in their "Settings->Reporting->UDP Server" options. The server can also reply asking WSJT-X to do certain things. Like colouring parts of decoded messages, or initiating a QSO with a station that called CQ. This so far is all straightforward with unicast addressing.

The WSJT-X UDP Message Protocol has always been intended to be used with multicast addressing which adds a whole new facet. That comes into play when a second application also wants to interoperate with the WSJT-X clients. With unicast addressing that would need a separate server address and port for each interoperating application, that adds a lot of complexity and does not scale well. With multicast addressing messages are sent to a multicast group address and every server that has joined the group, wherever they are on the Internet (with conditions as multicast wide-area routing is still not supported everywhere), will receive a copy of the message. With the WSJT-X UDP Message Protocol replies from servers to clients are always unicast since each reply message is intended for just one client.

Apart from a couple of applications that have implemented multicast, the main ways of having multiple applications interoperating with WSJT-X clients has been a forwarding arrangement on a different port. This allows applications to be "daisy-chained" together. There is one major limitation in this forwarding arrangement, only the first application in the chain can send replies to the WSJT-X clients, others can only receive messages in a passive way. There is no such restriction with multicast when used as intended.

There are several issues that have put us where we are currently, hopefully not for too much longer:
  • WSJT-X will send to unicast addresses, a necessity given the reasons below,
  • some applications are written with tools and libraries that do not support multicast, addressing,
  • every application must use multicast addressing before any can, there are no half-way measures with mixed support.
Note that switching a server application to listen on a multicast group address is trivial, usually only requiring a couple of basic networking function calls while setting up the server listening socket.

73
Bill
G4WJS.

On 04/08/2020 20:38, Dave Garber wrote:
what does multicast acheive
Dave Garber
VE3WEJ / VE3IE


On Tue, Aug 4, 2020 at 1:55 PM Charlie Hoffman <hoffmanc@...> wrote:
On Tue, Aug 4, 2020 at 03:00 AM, Dave Garber wrote:
I had no problem getting wsjtx, jta, and gridtracker all working together without multicast.
I also had no problem with them working together without multicast.
I've even been able to run GT on an old computer that's on the same network to free up screen space on my main computer.



--
73
Bill
G4WJS.

André C
 

Sorry to contradict you Carl, but Yes it does work the other way around.  I manage my radio with HamRadioDeluxe, which opened HRD Logbook. When WSJT-X makes a QSO, it forwarded it in HRD Logbook via the setup in JTalert.  I have WSJT-X talking to JTalert and JAalert talk to Gridtracker.  WSJT broadcast on port 2237, JAalert listen on 2237 and broadcast on 2337.  Gristracker listened on 2337 and broadcast on 2338.  Logger32 listens on UDP port 2338 to maintain my Logger32 software.  Hope this helps someone else, I had to figure it out by myself after many tries..


Le lun. 3 août 2020, à 22 h 34, Carl - WC4H via groups.io <wc4h.dx=yahoo.com@groups.io> a écrit :
Hi Richard.

To use both JTAlerts & GridTracker you need to flip what you are doing.
Let GridTracker listen on Port 2237, then turn on "Forward UDP Messages" to another port box (IE: 2238) in GT.  In GT these settimgs are in the General tab of settings.

For this to work, you MUST launch GridTracker first, then JTAlerts.  JTAlerts automatically finds the port that WSJT-X is using, so when you launch GT first, JTA will see port 2238 (in my example) and listen there.   It does not seem to work the other way around.

You can also turn on "Multicast" but if you just want to run the 2 programs simultaneously, it is not necessary.

This setup seems to work OK.  I have tested it and I have a friend that does it routinely.

If you are logging to DXLab, HRD, etc., you have to decide which program you want to do the logging so that you do not get duplicate entries.  You may also want to decide which of the two to use for sound alerts.

73.
Carl - WC4H

Jim Cooper
 

On 5 Aug 2020 at 6:39, HamApps Support (VK3AMA)
wrote:

On 5/08/2020 6:01 am, Kyle K7KE
wrote: > If you have an old PC or
tablet lying around, you can get
additional > screen real estate for
your main PC with this free program:
https//deskspace.net > > Kyle > K7KE
I believe the correct link is https://spacedesk.net/
that worked a lot better !!!

that utility looks as useful as the Synergy
one I have that lets my one mouse and keyboard
work with five different PCs ... trouble with
spacedesk is that I don't have room for any
more screens !!!

w2jc